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Re: [TenTec] din connector, etc.

To: Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment <tentec@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [TenTec] din connector, etc.
From: Mike Schatzberg <cherokeehillfarm@earthlink.net>
Reply-to: Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment <tentec@contesting.com>
Date: Wed, 24 Sep 2014 16:30:53 -0400
List-post: <tentec@contesting.com">mailto:tentec@contesting.com>
I'll ask on the 565/566 reflector whether anyone has issues with the 15 ms 
delay. 

My relays close in under 1 ms and I don't notice a problem.  Maybe I didn't 
watch the scope close enough. I can hear echos. 

Mike
W2AJI 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 24, 2014, at 4:13 PM, Rick - DJ0IP / NJ0IP <Rick@DJ0IP.de> wrote:
> 
> MIKE, I AM COMPLAINING.
> NOW YOU ARE AWARE OF ONE!  :-)
> 
> By the way, the Orion originally shipped with no hang time.
> Scott and I had a hefty debate whether QSK was the only thing needed and
> eventually I convinced Jack that there were plenty of people who do not want
> QSK and plenty more whose amp can't cope with it, so he had Gary contact me
> to understand the problem and the requirements.  Gary changed the software
> and the post dit delay (hang) was implemented.
> 
> Unfortunately the Eagle didn't get this hang delay either.
> Therefore an external box is required to add it when running older amps in
> CW mode.
> 
> 73 - Rick, DJ0IP
> (Nr. Frankfurt am Main)
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TenTec [mailto:tentec-bounces@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Mike
> Schatzberg
> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:08 PM
> To: k9yc@arrl.net; Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment
> Subject: Re: [TenTec] din connector, etc.
> 
> The Orion II delays RF for 15 ms after closure of the amplifier contacts.
> This applies to Ant1 and Ant2 as well. 
> 
> The amplifier hang time is adjustable for either Ant1 or Ant2 but the 15 ms
> delay is not adjustable and is applied in SSB and CW. 
> 
> The hang time keeps the amp from dropping out between characters if you
> wish. You can adjust it to hear your own echo coming back with very fast
> QSK. 
> 
> The 15 ms guarantees no hot switching of course with all QSK systems. 
> 
> No one has complained about a limitation in top speed that I am aware of. 
> 
> 73,
> Mike
> W2AJI 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 24, 2014, at 2:38 PM, Jim Brown <k9yc@audiosystemsgroup.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Understood, Rick.  But 17msec pretty much rules out QSK above about 18
> WPM. A strange design compromise for Ten Tec.  :)  Frankly, I'm both
> surprised and disappointed to see Ten Tec go for the lowest common
> denominator -- they never used to do that.  For my money, amps with open
> frame relays are for ragchewing on SSB, not serious operating.
>> 
>> FWIW, delay in the K3 is continuously adjustable, and I think it is in the
> FT1000MP too. I sold mine around 2008 to buy my K3s. The TS850, which I also
> owned,  is fixed at about 8 msec. The K2 is 8 msec.
>> 
>> Also FWIW, K6XX published a simple "speed up" circuit for T/R relays 
>> quite a few years ago, which he credits to K1KP. 
>> http://www.k6xx.com/radio/fastrely.pdf
>> 
>> 73, Jim K9YC
>> 
>>> On Wed,9/24/2014 2:08 AM, Rick - DJ0IP / NJ0IP wrote:
>>> Jim, I just sent an email explaining exactly how the Eagle works.
>>> The Orion and Omni VII both have 15mS initial delay.  The Eagle is 17.
>>> 
>>> "17mS" is relative.
>>> 
>>> For amps with vacuum relays or PIN Diode switching, it is long.
>>> For amps with open-frame relays it is too short.
>>> 
>>> I have never seen an open-frame relay that can switch in all cases, 
>>> no matter what, in less than 20ms.
>>> The open-frame relay used in all Ameritron amps can occasionally take 
>>> as long as 22mS - even though Ameritron advertises 15mS.
>> 
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