Yea it seems that everyone wants the radio to operate differently. If there
were 100,000 hams, they would want it to operate 100,000 different
ways.....or more, because some don't seem to know how they want it to
operate. And that goes for some that don't even own the radio. They too
seem to complain.
They seemingly want the cheapest radio to perform like the most expensive
elegant radio. Come on folks, get a grip on reality. It seems that hams
buy a cheap stock street car and then complain that it can't keep up with
the Indy 500 cars and it isn't their fault.
All of this is so ridiculous. As I said earlier......has anyone taken time
to read the manual and learn and understand how the radio works? Seems not
to be the case. Daily, I answer question after question via personal
e-mails received from persons that seem to find it easier to post a question
than it is to read the manual. This is becoming all too common. Oh yes, I
answer every personal e-mail and I do the research to find the answer. But
are people in general that stupid? Seem that the Smart Phone technology has
made for an increasingly more ignorant population.
Sorry for the rant folks..........but darn it.......it is true.
73
Bob, K4TAX
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rick - DJ0IP / NJ0IP" <Rick@DJ0IP.de>
To: "'Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment'" <tentec@contesting.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 4:27 PM
Subject: Re: [TenTec] din connector, etc.
Bob, when I submitting timing suggestions to John and Jack, I suggested
they
tie the pre-dit delay automatically to the type of amp keying used (which
is
menu selectable). If you use 2-cable amp keying, it delays about 10ms; if
you use single cable keying, it delays about 25ms.
The biggest problem with all of this is, even if the radio has the proper
adjustments, how many hams know how to set it up properly?
WinKey created a slick feature, defining the post dit delay (hang time) as
a
fixed (inverse) relationship to the keying speed. If you key faster, the
delay is shorter; if you key slower, the delay is longer. This avoids
relay
chatter, regardless of what speed you key at.
On the down side, I don't like having to use a computer to adjust my
keying
parameters.
Half the time when I get on the air, I don't even have the computer in the
shack switched on.
73 - Rick, DJ0IP
(Nr. Frankfurt am Main)
-----Original Message-----
From: TenTec [mailto:tentec-bounces@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Bob
McGraw
- K4TAX
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:12 PM
To: Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment
Subject: Re: [TenTec] din connector, etc.
Depends on how the radio is configured in conjunction with the amp.
If one has the radio, Orion or Omni VII, and amp configured, such as with
the Centurion or Titan, there is no issue regarding delay. If one is
using
the N.O. relay out of the radio to key the amp then there is a delay. To
answer your question it is YES and NO.
The Eagle radio provides excellent QSK within itself, but does not have
provision to interface with a QSK amp. It however will interface with a
non-QSK amp very satisfactorily.
The only objection I have running the Eagle and a non-QSK amp is the
clacking of the amp relay between CW elements. To correct this, some
external delay is required such as provided by the Tentec 318 Amp
interface.
73
Bob, K4TAX
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Schatzberg" <cherokeehillfarm@earthlink.net>
To: "Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment" <tentec@contesting.com>
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: [TenTec] din connector, etc.
I'll ask on the 565/566 reflector whether anyone has issues with the 15
ms
delay.
My relays close in under 1 ms and I don't notice a problem. Maybe I
didn't watch the scope close enough. I can hear echos.
Mike
W2AJI
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 24, 2014, at 4:13 PM, Rick - DJ0IP / NJ0IP <Rick@DJ0IP.de> wrote:
MIKE, I AM COMPLAINING.
NOW YOU ARE AWARE OF ONE! :-)
By the way, the Orion originally shipped with no hang time.
Scott and I had a hefty debate whether QSK was the only thing needed and
eventually I convinced Jack that there were plenty of people who do not
want
QSK and plenty more whose amp can't cope with it, so he had Gary contact
me
to understand the problem and the requirements. Gary changed the
software
and the post dit delay (hang) was implemented.
Unfortunately the Eagle didn't get this hang delay either.
Therefore an external box is required to add it when running older amps
in
CW mode.
73 - Rick, DJ0IP
(Nr. Frankfurt am Main)
-----Original Message-----
From: TenTec [mailto:tentec-bounces@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Mike
Schatzberg
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:08 PM
To: k9yc@arrl.net; Discussion of Ten-Tec Equipment
Subject: Re: [TenTec] din connector, etc.
The Orion II delays RF for 15 ms after closure of the amplifier
contacts.
This applies to Ant1 and Ant2 as well.
The amplifier hang time is adjustable for either Ant1 or Ant2 but the 15
ms
delay is not adjustable and is applied in SSB and CW.
The hang time keeps the amp from dropping out between characters if you
wish. You can adjust it to hear your own echo coming back with very fast
QSK.
The 15 ms guarantees no hot switching of course with all QSK systems.
No one has complained about a limitation in top speed that I am aware
of.
73,
Mike
W2AJI
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 24, 2014, at 2:38 PM, Jim Brown <k9yc@audiosystemsgroup.com>
wrote:
Understood, Rick. But 17msec pretty much rules out QSK above about 18
WPM. A strange design compromise for Ten Tec. :) Frankly, I'm both
surprised and disappointed to see Ten Tec go for the lowest common
denominator -- they never used to do that. For my money, amps with open
frame relays are for ragchewing on SSB, not serious operating.
FWIW, delay in the K3 is continuously adjustable, and I think it is in
the
FT1000MP too. I sold mine around 2008 to buy my K3s. The TS850, which I
also
owned, is fixed at about 8 msec. The K2 is 8 msec.
Also FWIW, K6XX published a simple "speed up" circuit for T/R relays
quite a few years ago, which he credits to K1KP.
http://www.k6xx.com/radio/fastrely.pdf
73, Jim K9YC
On Wed,9/24/2014 2:08 AM, Rick - DJ0IP / NJ0IP wrote:
Jim, I just sent an email explaining exactly how the Eagle works.
The Orion and Omni VII both have 15mS initial delay. The Eagle is 17.
"17mS" is relative.
For amps with vacuum relays or PIN Diode switching, it is long.
For amps with open-frame relays it is too short.
I have never seen an open-frame relay that can switch in all cases,
no matter what, in less than 20ms.
The open-frame relay used in all Ameritron amps can occasionally take
as long as 22mS - even though Ameritron advertises 15mS.
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