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Re: [VHFcontesting] IF Radios & XTRs

To: Terry Price <terry@directivesystems.com>, vhfcontesting@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] IF Radios & XTRs
From: Ed Kucharski <k3dne@comcast.net>
Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2023 16:34:49 -0500 (EST)
List-post: <mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
So, I'm not familiar with Elecraft products or the K3. Maybe I should be?
How do you configure with multiple xvtrs?
I own 2 FT736's but get frustrated now that they don't interface with a 
computer well (if at all).
What accessories besides the transverter interface are desirable in a K3?
73,
Ed K3DNE

>     On 01/16/2023 4:30 PM Terry Price <terry@directivesystems.com 
> mailto:terry@directivesystems.com > wrote:
> 
> 
>     You are right, the K3 doesn't "look" like a $5000 radio, it just works 
> like
>     one. The thing I love about the K3 is within the first 30 minutes on
>     touching one when they first came out, they were VERY intuitive. I've 
> owned
>     3 TS2000's and I still don't understand them!! I guess beauty is in the 
> eyes
>     of the beholder.
> 
>     Terry
> 
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: Kevin Hobbs [mailto:ve3kh@icloud.com mailto:ve3kh@icloud.com ]
>     Sent: Monday, January 16, 2023 3:29 PM
>     To: 'Terry Price' <terry@directivesystems.com 
> mailto:terry@directivesystems.com >; 'Ed Kucharski'
>     <k3dne@comcast.net mailto:k3dne@comcast.net >; 
> vhfcontesting@contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com
>     Subject: RE: [VHFcontesting] IF Radios & XTRs
> 
>     I bought a K3 and couldn't bare to look at it ... I thought it looked / 
> felt
>     like a cheap toy ... but maybe I shouid've judged it on usability and
>     integratability (maybe not a real word lol).
> 
>     Flex listened in the beginning and they made the 500A V/U ... best radio I
>     ever owned, when it worked properly, which wasn't very often ... between
>     Windows & FireWire and Updates, Flex bugs, database crashes / corruption,
>     unfulfilled promises of functionality I gave up and sold it. Many years
>     later I got sucked back in and bought a 6600M ... I struggle with it all
>     time, rearranging my XVTRs and interconnections trying to work around Flex
>     bugs that seem to have never been tested ... I keep hoping that sooner or
>     later it'll actually work as advertised, but it never seems to happen. I 
> 've
>     honestly felt like their XVTR & IO Beta Tester for years wasting countless
>     hours. The business model totally focuses on commercial sales and keeping
>     the HFers happy (which I totally understand but don't have to like) ... 
> they
>     just don't commit the resources to care about the VHF minority and they
>     never should've added XVTR ports if they didn't intend to properly support
>     them. It's kind of sad because the radio remembers everything when jumping
>     back and forth between HF Bands, but somehow no one gave a crap about the
>     fact that they let you make up as many XVTR entries as you like (which is
>     awesome) but since the radio sees them all as 28MHz I doesn't remember 
> your
>     settings for each XVTR Band making it incredibly frustrating trying to run
>     the bands in a VHF contest and then trying to get back to where you were 
> to
>     coordinate etc ... but apparently its no big deal because VHF contest QSO
>     rates are so low compared to HF that we should have plenty of time to
>     re-setup after every band change to make up for the software shortcomings.
> 
>     It seems that no matter what one chooses for VHF one be prepared for
>     workarounds !!!
> 
>     KH
> 
> 
> 
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: VHFcontesting 
> <vhfcontesting-bounces+ve3kh=icloud.com@contesting.com 
> mailto:vhfcontesting-bounces+ve3kh=icloud.com@contesting.com >
>     On Behalf Of Terry Price
>     Sent: January 16, 2023 11:58 AM
>     To: 'Ed Kucharski' <k3dne@comcast.net mailto:k3dne@comcast.net >; 
> vhfcontesting@contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com
>     Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] IF Radios & XTRs
> 
>     Ed et all,
> 
>     I think the entire reason the K3 works so well and fits so many niches is
>     Elecraft listened. Both Wayne and Eric answered questions and suggestions
>     directly from their reflector. The closest any of the Japanese companies
>     ever came was the good old Yaesu Ft736R and maybe some of the ICOMs. But
>     just look at the IC-9700, ICOMs latest VHF rig, if doesn't even offer per
>     band PTT output for individual amps and no band data unless you want to 
> roll
>     your own using an Arduino watching the CI-V. Yes I realize they are making
>     radios for worldwide consumption but I would this everyone would like 
> this.
>     I'm anxiously awaiting the new IC-905 to see how bad they butchered it. I
>     have a IC-705 and it has a single PTT output, no band data for steering 
> the
>     PTT and no CI-V jack. And, don't even get me started about 222 and 902 !!
> 
>     Unfortunately, we as VHF weak signal folks are such a minority that no one
>     will listen. They, like the ARRL, only cares about "shack on the belt" 
> types
>     and HF. Flex is an American company (I think) and being a true SDR, one
>     would think it could walk on water and leave tracks but only if the 
> software
>     engineers make it. One of our operators at K8GP/W8ZN has a Flex 6XXX and
>     after watching the amount of work it takes him to set it up and get it to
>     work, I'll keep my K3's until they put me in a pine box!
> 
>     Terry
> 
>     -----Original Message-----
>     From: VHFcontesting
>     [mailto:vhfcontesting-bounces+terry=directivesystems.com@contesting.com 
> mailto:vhfcontesting-bounces+terry=directivesystems.com@contesting.com ] On
>     Behalf Of Ed Kucharski
>     Sent: Monday, January 16, 2023 11:33 AM
>     To: vhfcontesting@contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com
>     Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] IF Radios & XTRs
> 
>     I have nothing to really add to this thread other than to vent my
>     frustration. Kevin alluded to it with his criticism of the Flex and xvtrs.
>     I'm particularly disappointed with Yaesu and their "flagship" radio
>     (FTDX101D / MP). No configuration or low level output for transverter
>     interfacing. I knew that before purchasing the radio and planned to 
> continue
>     to use my FT1000MP MKV as an IF but the '101 has many nice features I'd 
> like
>     to have when using it with transverters for 2m and up. A significant
>     oversight by Yaesu IMHO.
>     73,
>     Ed K3DNE
> 
> 
>         > >         On 01/16/2023 11:24 AM Kevin Hobbs via VHFcontesting
> > 
> >     >     <vhfcontesting@contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com 
> > mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com > 
> > wrote:
> 
>         > > 
> > 
> >         Thanks Terry ... that's what I figured ... I assume if the K3 does
> > 
> >     >     that then
> 
>         > >         K4 probably follows the same architecture. Seems like 
> just another
> > 
> >     >     VHF+ /
> 
>         > >         XVTR oversight by Flex Radio. 73 KH
> > 
> > 
> >         -----Original Message-----
> >         From: Terry Price <terry@directivesystems.com 
> > mailto:terry@directivesystems.com
> > 
> >     >     mailto:terry@directivesystems.com 
> > mailto:terry@directivesystems.com >
> 
>         > >         Sent: January 16, 2023 10:40 AM
> >         To: 'Kevin Hobbs' <ve3kh@icloud.com mailto:ve3kh@icloud.com 
> > mailto:ve3kh@icloud.com mailto:ve3kh@icloud.com >
> >         Cc: 'VHF Contesting Reflector' <vhfcontesting@contesting.com 
> > mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com
> > 
> >     >     mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com 
> > mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com >
> 
>         > >         Subject: RE: [VHFcontesting] IF Radios & XTRs
> > 
> >         Hi Kevin,
> > 
> >         Don't know about the K4 but I have four K3's and they remember
> >         every
> > 
> >     >     VHF
> 
>         > >         band so when I QSY say to 222.100 and then to another 
> band, when I
> > 
> >     >     come back
> 
>         > >         to 222, it is on 222.100 and the same mode. The K3 
> supports 10 VHF
> > 
> >     >     bands so
> 
>         > >         one radio can do 50 MHz (native) through 10GHz and the 
> dial shows the
> >         correct frequency. Each band can have a frequency correction of
> >         +/- 5
> > 
> >     >     KHz
> 
>         > >         (maybe 10 I can't remember) and the band data is standard 
> BCD that
> >         is
> > 
> >     >     also
> 
>         > >         mirrored for HF. There is a separate control line that 
> goes low
> >         when
> > 
> >     >     low
> 
>         > >         power transverter mode is selected so you can 
> differentiate
> >         between HF
> > 
> >     >     and
> 
>         > >         VHF and there is a PTT output, all of these signals are 
> available
> >         at
> > 
> >     >     the
> 
>         > >         HD15 acc connector on the back. So you can cover 160m 
> through 10
> >         GHz
> > 
> >     >     all
> 
>         > >         automatically with the right BCD decoder setup. If you 
> get one
> >         with
> > 
> >     >     the
> 
>         > >         internal 2m transverter, it can be set up to cover bands 
> from 902
> >         and
> > 
> >     >     up as
> 
>         > >         an I.F.
> > 
> >         73,
> > 
> >         Terry - W8ZN
> > 
> >         -----Original Message-----
> >         From: VHFcontesting
> > 
> > 
> >     >     
> > [mailto:vhfcontesting-bounces+terry=directivesystems.com@contesting.com 
> > mailto:vhfcontesting-bounces+terry=directivesystems.com@contesting.com
>     mailto:vhfcontesting-bounces+terry=directivesystems.com@contesting.com 
> mailto:vhfcontesting-bounces+terry=directivesystems.com@contesting.com ] On
> 
>         > >         Behalf Of Kevin Hobbs via VHFcontesting
> >         Sent: Monday, January 16, 2023 10:30 AM
> >         To: VHF Contesting <vhfcontesting@contesting.com 
> > mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com
> > 
> >     >     mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com 
> > mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com >
> 
>         > >         Subject: [VHFcontesting] IF Radios & XTRs
> > 
> >         Hi
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >         I have a Flex 6600M and a number of XVTRs connected to its XVTRA
> >         RXA
> > 
> >     >     ports
> 
>         > >         with external switching controlled via the Flex IO USB
> > 
> >         * 8 CH Relays to control DPDT coax switch to select between a Kuhne
> >         144 XVTR (which is the IF for 10 24 47 GHz XVTRs) and a Q5 5-Band
> >         XVTR
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >         My issue is that when I change VHF+ bands via the Flex, it resets
> >         my
> > 
> >     >     freq,
> 
>         > >         panadapter etc to default settings and so I can switch 
> back to
> >         where I
> > 
> >     >     was
> 
>         > >         when running the bands because the Flex thinks it all 
> 28MHz and
> >         even
> > 
> >     >     though
> 
>         > >         it handles all the XVTR's it doesn't have any band memory 
> /
> > 
> >     >     persistence for
> 
>         > >         XVTRs. This makes running the bands and going back and 
> forth to
> > 
> >     >     coordinate a
> 
>         > >         feal nuisance.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >         Does anyone have a workaround or know if some other HF IF rigs
> >         handle
> > 
> >     >     this
> 
>         > >         better ie: K3 or K4 ???
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >         73 Kevin VE3KH
> > 
> >         _______________________________________________
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> > 
> > 
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> > 
> > 
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