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Re: Topband: Thanks!

To: "Charlie Cunningham" <charlie-cunningham@nc.rr.com>, <topband@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: Topband: Thanks!
From: "Tom W8JI" <w8ji@w8ji.com>
Reply-to: Tom W8JI <w8ji@w8ji.com>
Date: Wed, 22 May 2013 09:35:06 -0400
List-post: <topband@contesting.com">mailto:topband@contesting.com>
I think that 31 material is probably a good choice for cleaning RF from
wiring that isn't handling RF power and where there isn't much in the way of
shunt impedance for the choke to work against -like a line from an
electricity meter carrying a much as 480 VAC (530 VAC at 480 high-line).`

That line has shunt impedances. Almost everything does. A main area for shunting impedance is the entrance ground.

The individual wires couple together fairly tight, so even the hot wires have shunt impedance.

This is one of the reasons antenna systems, with system design flaws causing common mode issues, have better reception (less noise) with improved grounding on the mains. The shunt impedance is as important as any series bead or choke string. The better the ground, the less important choke impedance is.

Another common point is downstream at the station. If the feeders have common mode from poor feed arrangements, reducing shunt impedance on the path from antenna feeders to power mains reduces noise.

Common mode chokes are part of a system.

Because I have a good entrance layout and cable bonding, just a single bead makes a large difference. If I had a sloppy arrangement with high shunt impedances, I could have fifty beads and not change much.

This is the problem with small antennas, or antennas with high common mode impedance. The antenna itself doesn't present much shunt impedance. The series part of the pi filter or attenuator formed by the shunt impedances and series beads or chokes is in a high impedance path, and has very little attenuation even with astronomical series impedances.

It is a system with huge variables if the variables are not controlled, not something that generally the same where one rule fits every system.

That's also an issue on high-speed digital circuits that can't tolerate much
in the way of shunt capacitance.

Not on individual lines, but when the lines are properly grouped they can have low shunt impedance for common mode and high shunt impedance for desired signal modes. Although we might not always think about it, we do that all the time in systems.

Not so sure about it as a "balun" on coax carrying much RF power!

Every different system has to be looked at as a unique system, but the best way to avoid troubles is to design feedpoints and equipment entrance points properly. Proper basics are far better than randomly peppering a mess of a system with beads.

The nice thing is what we do for lightning also works for RF, and vice versa.

An air coil choke is just as good as beads when the system is planned. As a matter of fact, we can build a nearly perfect single band balun with no beads and no solenoid chokes at all. An 80 meter dipole with a feedline in air and a ground ~~40-80 feet from the antenna has virtually no common mode without any balun at all. As a matter of fact, a balun could make it worse.

We need to think about the system more, and guess less.

73 Tom
All good topband ops know how to put up a beverage at night.
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