Hello,
To the question "does anyone actually take a Moxon portable or roving?" Yes, I
do. I rove with my 6 meter Moxon in most VHF contests. A full size 3 element
yagi is legally too large to turn while in motion. It overhangs the truck too
far. After using a Moxon I would never go back to a HO loop.
73,
Dave - W6TE
> From: vhfcontesting-request@contesting.com
> Subject: VHFcontesting Digest, Vol 127, Issue 10
> To: vhfcontesting@contesting.com
> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 16:06:55 -0400
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Yagi vs Moxon (John Baranyi)
> 2. Re: Yagi vs Moxon (Paul Kiesel)
> 3. Fwd: Central States VHF Society Conference, Elk Grove
> Village, IL, 7/26-28 (Mark Thompson)
> 4. Moxon Yagi loopers roving (Rick R)
> 5. Mid-Atl States VHF Conference (Rick R)
> 6. Re: Moxon Yagi loopers roving (Bill Olson)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 12:08:40 -0400
> From: John Baranyi <n8um@comcast.net>
> To: beamar <beamar@aol.com>
> Cc: vhfcontesting@contesting.com, vhf@w6yx.stanford.edu
> Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] Yagi vs Moxon
> Message-ID: <DD63E15F-46E8-438E-BBCD-5A8AECDBAB39@comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> I used a Par Moxon for years as part of a 50 - 2304 setup in The mountains of
> Tennessee. It took 13 minutes to level and crank up (fold up). It only took
> 9 minutes to drop and stow when motivated by an approaching Thunderstorm...
> See pix at http://www.chuckmartin.com/VHFContest2003_3.htm they were taken
> as Hurricane Sandy had just past. Best DX with these antennas were WA7JTM
> in Arizona on 2 meters and best DX with this set up on 1296 was K2DRH on 1296
> and W5LUA on 2304.
>
>
> John B. N8UM Oak Ridge, Tennessee
>
> On Jul 16, 2013, at 11:06 AM, beamar <beamar@aol.com> wrote:
>
> > When operating portable or roving, something you have to be concerned with
> > is how easily can the antenna be damaged. For example, Loop Yagis are
> > easier to bash up than linear Yagis. That is why I use an M2 for 1296, even
> > though I am convinced that a Loop Yagi is the superior antenna. Has anybody
> > on the list actually taken a Moxon portable or roving?
> > --
> > Buddy WB4OMG
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > VHFcontesting mailing list
> > VHFcontesting@contesting.com
> > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/vhfcontestingusedaPar a Par
> > moxon
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 09:07:05 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Paul Kiesel <k7cw@yahoo.com>
> To: "Mike \(KA5CVH\) Urich" <mike@ka5cvh.com>, beamar <beamar@aol.com>
> Cc: vhf contesting <vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
> Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] Yagi vs Moxon
> Message-ID:
> <1373990825.17961.YahooMailNeo@web122305.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> One should ask, "It doesn't take a lot of horsepower to work what?" One often
> hears that all you need is a dipole when the band is open. Those who
> subscribe to that myth reap the benefits of their belief. A moxon is little
> better than a dipole.
>
> Now, if your issue is being able to drive with the antenna erected, you have
> to take the size of the antenna into account. One could argue that it is
> better to stop to do the operating. Both because when you are driving, you
> will be paying total attention to the road and also because you would be able
> to erect a decent antenna for when you operate.
>
> Just my 2-cents after having done it myself for a number of years.
>
> 73, Paul K7CW
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Mike (KA5CVH) Urich <mike@ka5cvh.com>
> To: beamar <beamar@aol.com>
> Cc: vhf contesting <vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, July 16, 2013 7:58 AM
> Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] Yagi vs Moxon
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 9:27 AM, beamar <beamar@aol.com> wrote:
>
> Personally I would not take a 3 element Yagi, roving. But a Moxon, I
> would take.
>
> Mike wrote
>
> I tend to agree that is why I am looking at the Moxon.? I have the old
> CC A50-3S that works but looking to minimize the footprint and
> overhead <no pun> of the bigger antenna some.? I see the trade off as
> a small price to pay as we all know when 6 is open it doesn't take a
> lot of horsepower.
>
> --
> Mike Urich KA5CVH
> http://ka5cvh.com
>
> "My cars all run on recycled dinosaurs"
>
> PIO - D14 S/E - http://harriscountyares.org
> APIC - D1 & D14 - http://www.arrlstx.org
>
> Life is hard, church shouldn't be!
> http://fairmontpark.org
> _______________________________________________
> VHFcontesting mailing list
> VHFcontesting@contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/vhfcontesting
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 09:14:29 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Mark Thompson <wb9qzb_groups@yahoo.com>
> To: "vhfcontesting@contesting.com" <vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
> Cc: "w9xa@yahoo.com" <w9xa@yahoo.com>
> Subject: [VHFcontesting] Fwd: Central States VHF Society Conference,
> Elk Grove Village, IL, 7/26-28
> Message-ID:
> <1373991269.19690.YahooMailNeo@web125205.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>
>
> ----- Forwarded Message -----
>
> From: Kermit Carlson <w9xa@yahoo.com>
> To: Kermit Carlson W9XA <w9xa@yahoo.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 10, 2013 8:27 PM
> Subject: [frrl] 2013 Central States VHF Society Conference July 26-28
>
>
> Greetings !
>
> ??? ??? The 2013 Central States VHF Society Conference
> committee invites you to a full weekend of VHF/UHF
> activity the weekend of? July 26th-through-July 28th.?
> This 47th? Annual Conference is being held at the
> Elk Grove Village? Holiday Inn at 1000 Busse Rd
> located at the South-West? corner Route 83 and
> Landwehr Road in Elk Grove Village.
> ??? ??? The activities begin Friday morning at 9AM with antenna
> range gain measurements and
> pre-amp noise figure measurement
> contests. Technical Programs are held Friday afternoon
> and all day Saturday. The detailed Agenda and full information
> ?can be found at;
> http://www.csvhfs.org/2013conference/index.html????
> ??? ??? The Society is fortunate to be able to welcome noted
>
> VHF/UHF and 10 Ghz enthusiast Mr Dave Sumner K1ZZ,
> Chief Executive Officer of the ARRL? to this year's
> conference as our Keynote Speaker.? Please plan to attend
>
> Saturday's Banquet when you sign-up for the Conference.?
>
> Registrations for the Banquet will close on Thursday the 18th of July
> so please take time now to? reserve? your dinner selection;
>
> http://www.csvhfs.org/2013conference/2013Registration.html
> ????????
> The Forum Speakers and Topics for the 2013 Central States VHF Society
> Conference - Chicago/Elk Grove Village? will include;?????
>
>
> James Kennedy, K6MIO(/KH6)
> ??? Worldwide Es Propagation on 27-29 June 2012
>
> Kent Britain, WA5VJB
> ??? Unusual Antennas for Unusual Applications
>
>
> James Froemke, K0MHC
> ??? Where have all the ROVERS gone?
> Ed Krome, K9EK
> ?? Building and Testing VHF/UHF Power Amps based on the
> ?
>
> Freescale LD-MOS Modules
>
> ?
> James Kennedy, K6MIO(/KH6)
> ??? Solar Cycle Update
>
>
> Wayne Overbeck, N6NB
> ??Building a Tower Trailer for Roving (and Why!)
> ?
> Jon Platt, W0ZQ
> ??? Gitchi Gami and the 2012 ARRL 10 GHz Contest
>
>
> Terry Price, W8ZN
> ??? 1.5 kW Larcan 222 MHz Amplifier
>
>
> ?Keith Pugh, W5IU
> ??? AMSAT and ARISS Update 2013
>
>
> ?Al Ward, W5LUA
> ??? Working Small Stations on 10 and 24 GHz EME with help of
> ????
>
> WSJT
>
> Gerald Johnson, K0CQ
> ??? Multiple "mini"-topics (Antenna Modeling, Test "Tricks" to
> ????
>
> better your GHz signal, Soldering)
>
> ?Central States VHF? Society Sponsored Activities and Awards -
>
> This will be s moderated session that will recognize the
> ?
>
> 2012-2013 States Above 50 MHz results, Reverse VUCC and the
> ?
>
> 2013 VHF & Up Spring Sprints. This session will extend into a
> ? discussion of the Future of the Spring VHF & Up Sprints.
> ?
> ???????? We look forward to seeing you at the Conference !
>
>
> ?????????????????????????????????? 73, Kermit Carlson W9XA
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 13:38:15 -0400
> From: Rick R <rick1ds@hotmail.com>
> To: vhf contesting <vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
> Subject: [VHFcontesting] Moxon Yagi loopers roving
> Message-ID: <BAY169-W252DF18C0D431C041A20FFA600@phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I have used a variety of all of the above while roving over 20 years.
> I currently use the 6m Moxon for light weight and ease of handling. It's OK,
> and when 6 is open, it doesn't matter what antenna you have as a rover, as
> long as it can radiate. I have written about that in the June VHF summaries
> in QST of folks' experiences with all sorts of "wet noodles" and low power
> when 6 is open. Anything goes. The most important concern is that the antenna
> be high enough above the ground (or vehicle roof and other antennas) to allow
> it to radiate in the designed pattern.
> BUT--I have had some issues with the PAR Moxon. Over the few years I have
> used it, the lighter weight elements have sagged, the wire element has sagged
> and caught on things and pulled the tubular elements out of their holes. The
> insulator of the driven element also broke when the unit fell, but the
> company replaced that piece for free. All these are easy to repair. Overall I
> think it's a great rover antenna and I will continue to use it.
> I did use a 3L beam in the past, but I gave it away to a fellow ham who
> wanted to get on 6m. It was good when I used it, but a little too big for my
> rover setup. It really didn't make a difference what antenna I used for 6m. I
> have even used just a dipole. I have a 12 band rover, and the big deal for me
> is working fixed stations on 2m and then moving them up the bands. We hit 6m
> last as that is the 1 point band. And when 6 is open, any antenna works and
> few people stop to run the bands.
> I use 4 loopers for bands 9EFG and the key to keeping them in better shape
> roving is to mount them with the loops downward. You learn very quickly that
> low branches and leaves will catch and bend the loops when they are mounted
> in the up position. They are all mounted on 1 crossbar that is then fastened
> to the main mast. Polarization is still horizontal. GL. Rick, K1DS
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 16:01:57 -0400
> From: Rick R <rick1ds@hotmail.com>
> To: vhf contesting <vhfcontesting@contesting.com>, VHF REFLECTOR
> <vhf@w6yx.stanford.edu>, "vhfrovers@yahoogroups.com"
> <vhfrovers@yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [VHFcontesting] Mid-Atl States VHF Conference
> Message-ID: <BAY169-W1277B275EF8DFC594339D32FA600@phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Sign up now and be an earlybird for the Mid-Atlantic States VHF Conference
> September 27-29 at the InnPlace Hotel in Bensalem PA Next to PARX Casino
> Special rate $79+tax/night mention "VHF Conference" includes continental
> breakfast
> All info and on-line or mail-in registration and payment at www.packratvhf.com
> Papers still being accepted for proceedings disc -- mail to
> rick1ds@hotmail.com
> Fri eve--Meet your VHF buddies-Hospitality-tabletop selling
> Saturday--Presentations --see speakers list below
> Saturday evening--Buffet Banquet with door prizes
> Sunday morning mini-hamfest outdoor fleamarket
> $40 Earlybird by Sept 13 includes conference, hospitality, proceedings disc,
> Sat lunch and snack
> $40 Buffet Banquet. You must be registered and paid for both to be eligible
> for door prizes
>
> Rick K1DS Love to Rove
> Phil K3TUF Tower Safety
> Roger W3SZ Aircraft Scatter: New Software (ISCAT) and New
> Horizons
> Steve W1SMS VHF Amplifiers: Tubes or Solid State
> John KB3XG Solid State 2KW Amplifiers for 6m & 2m
> Steve N5AC SDR for VHF, UHF & Microwaves
> Dale AF1T 10GHz and Up contesting
> Paul K4MSG Early Navy EME
> Elliott K3JJZ Multi-op Contest Log Networking
> Ken KA2LIM The K2LIM Contest Station
> Paul WA3GFZ Unique Antenna Mounting Solution
> Ray N3RG Antenna Homebrew Workshop
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 20:06:47 +0000
> From: Bill Olson <callbill@hotmail.com>
> To: VHF Contest Reflector <vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
> Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] Moxon Yagi loopers roving
> Message-ID: <BAY165-W35B1EAE66C73218AE614C4C6600@phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi Rick and all, This is an interesting thread that brings up LOTS of issues
> besides just comparing a Moxon to a Yagi.. First of all a Moxon is, of
> course, just a 2 element Yagi with the ends of the elements bent towards
> each other to reduce the width and, (since the 2 elements are mechanically
> connected) I suppose add some strength. Even though it "looks" like a loop it
> is not and has a directional pattern.. Well everyone probably knows that, but
> as Rick states, what really is important about 6M antennas is the height
> above ground.. A Moxon, Halo, 2 element Yagi or 7 element Yagi MUST be higher
> above the ground than one can travel with on a rover. AA9D, multiop contest
> station from IL, did some test years ago and compared a halo (not sure which
> one but it doesn't really matter - they all have gain LESS than a dipole) to
> a 5 element Yagi (correct me someone if I have the # of elements wrong). The
> Yagi was at "top of car height", say 7-10 feet, and the halo was at 20'. The
ha
> lo outperformed the Yagi on all "non-skywave" paths. This is with a
> difference in published gain of something like 10dB!!! The reason is the
> pattern gets elevated when the antenna is close to the ground. (The gain is
> still there, actually, but not on the horizon) That's why the halo (or any
> antenna actually) close to the ground works so well when the band is open for
> e-skip. I used to rove with a 4 element beam on the bottom of a stack of 4
> yagis. It was probably 7 or 8 ft off the ground. (yeah it hung out over the
> sides of the vehicle, having a maximum element length of about 10ft but I
> never hit anything or got a ticket). BUT.. with this setup I hardly ever
> worked ANYTHING except really close stations except when there was e-skip at
> which point the elevated pattern actually made it work GREAT and the shorter
> the skip, the better it worked.. So now, having learned my lesson, I rove
> with a home made 2 element beam on a 4 ft boom. It's light weight and easy to
> stow and I u
se
> it with a 18 ft mast. I actually stow the thing connected to the mast and
> just pop it up at locations on a mount attached to my receiver hitch, so the
> beam is actually 20 ft high or so.. This setup has yielded many 200-300 mile
> dead band "ground wave" contacts and I love it. The pattern is quite broad in
> the e-plane so you don't have to do a LOT of rotation.. (especially up here
> where ALL stations are basically southwest) Down side is you can't operate 6m
> while in motion!
>
> This all leads into my second subject. There are at least 2 ways to skin the
> rover cat I guess.. Some guys (I am one of them) like to use as big of
> antennas as they can get (and high power etc) on the vehicle and actually try
> to work DX from each stop. Others let the vehicle do the work and actually
> *drive* to the rare grid. I always thought roving with omnidirectional
> antennas with no gain was pretty ridiculous, but now see that it's not a bad
> way to go if you like to drive a lot. Hit a WHOLE LOT of grids and keep
> moving and work everyone you can from each stop and even along the way. The
> "grid circling" rovers take this scheme to a higher level, but it's the same
> idea.. Of course driving to lots of grids AND having a station capable of
> 200,300mile + contacts is even better, but eventually we run out of time or
> road or whatever..
>
> I still recommend reading the late W3IY - Bill Seabreeze's web page.
> http://www.w1rt.us/w3iy/ . Bill would hit a TON of grids and even when he
> was down on the middle Atlantic shore in the FM grids, we'd stand a chance of
> working him up here in Maine. Read Bill's app note on rover yagi stacking
> too.. It contradicts a lot of the info out there and I've been working on a
> presentation to show why - maybe get it to one of the conferences one of
> these years.. Anyway, Bill turned in really great rover scores.. and he had
> fun too I can assure you.
>
> Anyway, yada yada..
>
> bill, K1DY in Maine
>
> > From: rick1ds@hotmail.com
> > To: vhfcontesting@contesting.com
> > Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2013 13:38:15 -0400
> > Subject: [VHFcontesting] Moxon Yagi loopers roving
> >
> > I have used a variety of all of the above while roving over 20 years.
> > I currently use the 6m Moxon for light weight and ease of handling. It's
> > OK, and when 6 is open, it doesn't matter what antenna you have as a rover,
> > as long as it can radiate. I have written about that in the June VHF
> > summaries in QST of folks' experiences with all sorts of "wet noodles" and
> > low power when 6 is open. Anything goes. The most important concern is that
> > the antenna be high enough above the ground (or vehicle roof and other
> > antennas) to allow it to radiate in the designed pattern.
> > BUT--I have had some issues with the PAR Moxon. Over the few years I have
> > used it, the lighter weight elements have sagged, the wire element has
> > sagged and caught on things and pulled the tubular elements out of their
> > holes. The insulator of the driven element also broke when the unit fell,
> > but the company replaced that piece for free. All these are easy to repair.
> > Overall I think it's a great rover antenna and I will continue to use it.
> > I did use a 3L beam in the past, but I gave it away to a fellow ham who
> > wanted to get on 6m. It was good when I used it, but a little too big for
> > my rover setup. It really didn't make a difference what antenna I used for
> > 6m. I have even used just a dipole. I have a 12 band rover, and the big
> > deal for me is working fixed stations on 2m and then moving them up the
> > bands. We hit 6m last as that is the 1 point band. And when 6 is open, any
> > antenna works and few people stop to run the bands.
> > I use 4 loopers for bands 9EFG and the key to keeping them in better shape
> > roving is to mount them with the loops downward. You learn very quickly
> > that low branches and leaves will catch and bend the loops when they are
> > mounted in the up position. They are all mounted on 1 crossbar that is then
> > fastened to the main mast. Polarization is still horizontal. GL. Rick, K1DS
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > VHFcontesting mailing list
> > VHFcontesting@contesting.com
> > http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/vhfcontesting
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> VHFcontesting mailing list
> VHFcontesting@contesting.com
> http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/vhfcontesting
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of VHFcontesting Digest, Vol 127, Issue 10
> **********************************************
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