Topband
[Top] [All Lists]

Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Skywave vs. Earth Conductivity

To: k1fz@myfairpoint.net, Topband <topband@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: Topband: [Bulk] Re: Skywave vs. Earth Conductivity
From: Grant Saviers <grants2@pacbell.net>
Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2015 12:29:38 -0800
List-post: <topband@contesting.com">mailto:topband@contesting.com>
At TX5D (FO-A), I was able to instant A/B a 15m vertical (two elevated radials) at high tide line vs a crankIR tuned on 15m about 70' from high tide. US stations (5k to 7k km) reported 1 to 2 S unit improvements with the antenna nearer to the lagoon salt water. Received signals were at least that much improved.

There is a NEC4 analysis of two semicircular grounds, one salt water the other average earth which verifies the improvement. Not sure where it is published though. I think this model shows the closer to salt water the better and less than 1/2wl is where the improvement is significant. Somewhere around 1.5wl there is no improvement.

Grant KZ1W


On 2/13/2015 7:53 AM, K1FZ-Bruce wrote:
Low band hams are very aware of "sea gain" minimum salt water attenuation at low angles. The signal will not produce a perfect circle as the posting shows.
73
Bruce-K1FZ
www.qsl.net/k1fz/beveragenotes.html

On Fri, 13 Feb 2015 10:35:28 -0500, Bill Whitacre <bw@his.com> wrote:
Perhaps FCC models don't take account of 'sea gain?' ITU models do, as I recall.

Bill Whitacre
Alexandria, VA

---

> On Feb 13, 2015, at 7:43 AM, Richard Fry <rfry@adams.net> wrote:
> > From my reading of posts on many "ham" boards, the prevailing thoughts are that the nighttime skywave field intensity received from a vertical monopole is dependent on earth conductivity -- as well as on frequency, radiated power, path length, and atmospheric conditions. > > The plot linked below applies to the skywave from WFAN, a New York City station on 660 kHz using 50 kW/24-7 and an omni vertical radiator. It shows the FCC 0.25 mV/m RMS contour for the skywave received 50% of the time, six hours after sunset in NYC. > > There is no visible/useful difference in the radius to that contour over the ocean than over the land. > > This plot doesn't appear to be supported by a NEC far-field analysis of such a system -- on which (apparently) most hams base their conclusions about the skywave coverage potential of a vertical monopole for given values of earth conductivity. > > One reason for this difference is that NEC far-field calculations apply to ~infinite distances over a flat ground plane. > > Just wondering what thoughts others have on this subject. > > http://s20.postimg.org/f1z0o2e7h/WFAN_Skywave.gif
> > R. Fry, CPBE
_________________
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband





_________________
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband

_________________
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband

<Prev in Thread] Current Thread [Next in Thread>