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Re: [VHFcontesting] Power budget

To: vhfcontesting@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [VHFcontesting] Power budget
From: John Young via VHFcontesting <vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
Reply-to: nosigma@aol.com
Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2018 06:24:13 -0400
List-post: <mailto:vhfcontesting@contesting.com>
Dan

The AC start up load should be in the specs.  If not, double the running 
current draw if its a bleed down unit, triple the running load if its not.

In the 90's I built and operated several shelterized instrumentation radars for 
use in deserts on generator power.  Generators had to package in the shelters 
for deployment.  Inverter generators did not exist back then.

AC was a pain.  Large random current draws and voltage drops on start up 
followed by voltage surges on shut down.  This wreaks havok on sensitive 
equipment.  To lesser extent resistance heaters and blowers did the same thing.

Much of the start up problem is due to commercial AC units not having a bleed 
down capability so they try to start up against a HEAVY compressor load.  Lots 
of insulation, white paint on the roof and a silver side up tarp over the roof 
for shade and an air gap minimized short cycling of the AC.  But the huge start 
up load was still there.

AC units with compressor bleed down and interlocks to prevent a loaded start up 
were special order, militarized mobile units back then.  This helped A LOT.  It 
may be a more common item on RV units today, check for this capabity. A home 
window unit probably wont have it.

Even with all of this I had to size the generator for twice the max current 
draw of the AC unit on start up stay over 100 volts so the electronics were not 
too unhappy.  Straight generators depend on rpm for gross voltage stability.  
Inverters will still surge as the throttle opens under a big load spike, but to 
a much lesser extent.

The AC load will far and away be the biggest load on your system.  Once running 
I found that the AC generated an unacceptable level of noise on the power 
lines.  This led to a lot of filtering for the radar electronics.

Taken all together this resulted in an acceptable but far from ideal solution.

Ultimately I ended up with TWO 10kw generators.  One for electronics and one 
for support functions.  The shelters were rewired to isolate them from each 
other but the were still minor disturbances through the shared a.c. grounds.

When the radar was in standby the load was so low on the electonics generator I 
had to add a resistor bank to force the generator off idle to a stable 3600rpm 
level.  I could have used a smaller electronics generator but one is none and 
two is one, plus I would have to double up on spares.


Here is what I suggest:
An inverter generator for the electronics on its own circuit.
An AC unit with compressor bleed down.
A second generator (inverter or conventional) for the AC which is oversized by 
at least 50% for the start up load, 100% if the AC doesnt have bleed down, you 
dont care about voltage spikes on this generator as long as the AC can handle 
it.  Conventional generators are much cheaper at higher power levels.
Keep the grounds seperated.

With the second generator you can bring a coffee maker, small fridge, a 
microwave, lights, floods for set up and have all the comforts of home.  

73
John
KM4KMU



Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Saturday, March 10, 2018 Dan Evans via VHFcontesting 
<vhfcontesting@contesting.com> wrote:
Hello group, I'm putting together a small (12') pull behind trailer for grid 
hopping / portable operations.  It's actually a 1967 Winnabago that I'm 
restoring / remodeling. Anyway, I would like to add a small window unit air 
conditioner to make summer operating bearable.  The original AC unit is long 
dead, so I was planning to install a 5000 BTU.  This is the smallest unit I've 
been able to find.  My question is how much generator am I going to need for 
this setup?  I know one of the small inverter types should be plenty to run my 
radio equipment, but will it handle the AC? I know there are plenty of guys on 
the list that have been down this road before, so I would appreciate your 
input! 73Dan -- K9ZF  Vice President, Clark County Amateur Radio Club,Amateur 
Radio Emergency Service, Clark County Indiana. EM78el The once and future K9ZF 
/R no budget Rover  ***QRP-l #1269 Check out the Rover Resource Page at:  List 
Administrator for: InHam+grid-loc+ham-books  Ask me how to join the Indiana Ham 
Mailing list! On Saturday, March 10, 2018, 12:31:28 PM EST, Mike & Becca 
Krzystyniak <k9mk@flash.net> wrote: Greetings All,     James, AF5EH is selling 
his pair of HP 8753C (3 GHz) & HP 8753D (6GHz) model network analyzers.     
Both have their respective S parameter sets and fresh CRT's.     Anyone 
interested?  If yes, please contact James off list at james at jwarden dot com 
Thanks for reading this. 73's  Mike K9MK 
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