If you're remotely contemplating a UST, consider a LUSO for just a few dollars
more!
> On Jan 2, 2017, at 16:55, Wayne Kline <w3ea@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I think the 10 minutes is the welding time, surly not the set up " installing
> the pieces into the welding Jig " and from my observation only the bottom
> and top area plates ( which would have the pillow block brackets pre welded
> on ) are the only area which would require multiple passes .
>
> With big Arco or Miller Flux core machines .... 10 min would be on the low
> end of time But 30 to 35 min from raw pieces to finished craned off unit
> more like it.
>
>
> Wayne W3EA
>
> ________________________________
> From: TowerTalk <towertalk-bounces@contesting.com> on behalf of EZ Rhino
> <EZRhino@fastmovers.biz>
> Sent: Monday, January 2, 2017 6:44 PM
> To: Towertalk Reflector
> Subject: Re: [TowerTalk] US Tower price increase
>
> Ten minutes huh? I want to see that. Send me a video.
>
> Chris
> KF7P
>
>
> On Jan 2, 2017, at 16:26 , Kevin wrote:
>
> Chris,
>
> I used to do it for a living. I was certified to weld just about anything
> anywhere, except underwater.
>
> They are NOT a start up. They've had all the tooling and "machinery" for many
> years now. ALL of their crank ups are a variation of 5 or 6 20' tower
> sections whose jigs were built years ago. I could probably weld one in 10
> minutes, even with my poor eyesight and prosthetic leg.
>
> Press brakes, CNC Plasma tables, CNC lathes, welders, etc...don't need
> replacing very often, if ever, given proper maintenance. We had a WWII turret
> lathe that still put out very good parts, maybe not CNC quality but good
> enough.
>
> They're building towers not high performance engines or wrist watches.
>
> Kinda funny that Tashjian hasn't raised their prices by a factor of three.
> They're 20 miles apart and probably have quite a few of the same suppliers.
>
> They simply don't want to be in the amateur market any longer.
>
>
>
>> On 1/2/2017 4:56 PM, EZ Rhino wrote:
>> Good points Jim.
>>
>> I may also add that a lot of us (including myself, at times) are spoiled.
>> We clickety click click on line, and two days later a product is in our
>> mailbox. We no longer realize how things are manufactured or the time,
>> energy and cost associated with producing a product.
>>
>> Metal fabrication isn't an inexpensive or easy business to be in. The
>> machinery needed to fabricate a tower is expensive, er, I mean, EXPENSIVE!
>> and HUGE! CNC plasma tables, press brakes, welding equipment, CNC benders,
>> jigs, fixturing tables, tooling, tooling, and more tooling, and qualified
>> experienced operators of this machinery, and don't forget a huge building
>> that can store all this stuff. Metal fab is a slow process, lots of labor,
>> and lots of trial and error to figure out how to make something that
>> functions correctly. Then you need to figure out the most economical way to
>> mass produce the product with the least labor as possible. It's not easy.
>>
>> I am not excusing the price increases at UST, as they do sound out of line.
>> But I do think getting a new 50-foot crank up for $3k is a bargain!
>>
>> Also watch the used market, where you can get a real deal on some used
>> stuff. I watched the classifieds like a hawk for almost a year, finally
>> found a TriEx LM470 that was still horizontal, still partially crated, never
>> installed, and got it for a song.
>>
>> Chris
>> KF7P
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 2, 2017, at 15:43 , jimlux wrote:
>>
>> On 1/2/17 11:38 AM, Jim Brown wrote:
>>> Great response, Jim. BUT -- the increase noted by the original poster
>>> was that the increase was overnight!
>>>
>>> Several possible reasons for this. One is that business operations for
>>> the ham market are often supported by higher volume and higher margin
>>> operations for other markets. When those other markets fall apart, they
>>> no longer support the ham market, or contribute to economies of scale
>>> that allow lower prices.
>>>
>>> Another is corporate mergers, which can change business priorities,
>>> change where products are manufactured.
>>>
>>> But assuming corporate greed as the reason for all such price increases
>>> is unreasonable. It certainly can be, but there are many other reasons.
>>>
>> yes, I agree.. usually it's a "it's not economic to sell at that price any
>> more, compared to other products". I was more commenting on the "back in
>> 85" comment.
>>
>> I know someone who is buying 50 tower trailers with 100+ ft towers on them.
>> That's a much better sale proposition than onsie, twosie sales to
>> individuals. Whether through distribution or not, the support costs tend to
>> be "per customer" not "per tower".
>>
>> As for the overnight x3... That's a "we don't really want to be in this
>> business" or "our cost structure radically changed" kind of increase.
>>
>> I've also seen that when you have a business founder of a family operated
>> business retires/sells out: the founder didn't have any debt service costs,
>> was willing to live out whatever margin there was. The new owner had to get
>> a loan to buy the business and actually has to pay employees a wage and
>> benefits - all of a sudden instead of "my wife does the assembly and we're
>> on the same insurance" it's "I've got to pay a reasonable wage and provide
>> vacation, insurance, etc.", I've got to pay rent and storage costs, I've got
>> to pay for the "cost of money".
>>
>> A similar phenomenon occurs when a partner retires/dies/leaves and the
>> remaining partners have to buy them out.
>>
>> Or, it's just - we don't want to leave existing customers totally in the
>> lurch, but we can't subsidize them either - we'll be responsible and at
>> least make parts available, but at cost that is basically "fabricate from
>> scratch individually"
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>
> --
> R. Kevin Stover
> AC0H
> ARRL
> FISTS #11993
> SKCC #215
> NAQCC #3441
>
>
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