What does this have to do with contesting?
On 8/15/2025 11:19 AM, Charles Cassidy wrote:
Good afternoon,
How can we clean up all the cursing on 80m.
I am starting to hear more cursing on 40m.
I am afraid this problem with bad language is going to make it harder to
get new people into amateur radio. Any ideas?
Thanks,
Chuck, W2CSI
On Fri, Aug 15, 2025 at 12:14 PM <cq-contest-request@contesting.com> wrote:
Send CQ-Contest mailing list submissions to
cq-contest@contesting.com
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
cq-contest-request@contesting.com
You can reach the person managing the list at
cq-contest-owner@contesting.com
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of CQ-Contest digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (Doug Grant)
2. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (Bruce Horn)
3. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (Victor A)
4. Kansas City Keyer (Rene K5JX)
5. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (RT Clay)
6. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (john@kk9a.com)
7. WRTC 2026 reflector (Lee Volante)
8. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (Stan Zawrotny)
9. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (Jim Brown)
10. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (Tim Shoppa)
11. Re: Ham Radio in the Future (Steve IK4WMH)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 17:33:22 +0000
From: Doug Grant <dougk1dg@gmail.com>
To: CQ Contest <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID:
<
CAFrbnByCEMKFOrgy-MKC9g8sGTHAhFdYm2gyvJAT34w-ZccvXg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
This discussion about the future reminded me of a piece I wrote back in
1993
<
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/az2n7qtgr1ll21dcg9rxy/Reflections-on-the-2005-CQWWW-Contest.pdf?rlkey=9n02x4b4b8v8235hc2fkjfz0u&st=6fbusa61&dl=0
.
I thought that contests conducted by radio transmission would have gone
extinct by 2005, but here we are in 2025, still dancing with the
ionosphere.
Anyway, while we are thinking about the future, maybe this will be
entertaining.
73,
Doug K1DG
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 08:54:18 -0500 (CDT)
From: Bruce Horn <bhorn@hornucopia.com>
To: cq-contest <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID:
<1037713813.32286009.1755179658799.JavaMail.zimbra@hornucopia.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
For CWACs, you want to be able to leverage the log adjudication process of
the primary contest sponsor. Otherwise, there won't be consistency across
the CWACs based on a contest as to what was considered to be a valid QSO.
The main contest sponsor would need to be willing to share a dataset of
valid QSOs that could be then rescored. Currently, the shared public logs
contain all QSOs, whether they were determined to be valid or not.
73 de Bruce, WA7BNM (bhorn@hornucopia.com)
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe" <nss@mwt.net>
To: "cq-contest" <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2025 7:21:18 PM
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
But then think of like Plaque sponsors.
A club sponsors an overlay. And anyone that is chasing or entering in
that overlay sends their log to the sponsoring of the overlay group.
This way you have the overlay and no extra work for the main contest
organizers.
Joe WB9SBD
On 8/13/2025 2:52 PM, Ward Silver wrote:
CWACs (Contests Within A Contest) could be more popular if there were
better ways of reporting the results. We have some overlays - that's a
step in the right direction. Adding more work for the sponsors is
probably
a non-starter at this point, though.
73, Ward N0AX
On Wed, Aug 13, 2025 at 11:07?AM <cq-contest-request@contesting.com>
wrote:
Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2025 11:52:12 +0000
From: Randy Thompson <k5zd@outlook.com>
To: Mike Fatchett W0MU <w0mu@w0mu.com>
Cc: "cq-contest@contesting.com" <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID:
<
IA3P223MB176800D16A16B745C42CE63B9C2AA@IA3P223MB1768.NAMP223.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
The things you are proposing could easily be layered over an existing
contest. Have at it and let?s see how it works.
Randy K5ZD
On Aug 13, 2025, at 3:20?AM, Mike Fatchett W0MU <w0mu@w0mu.com> wrote:
?Event...Like the 1st one to work W1AAA gets bonus points......The 1st
to 50 contacts gets..... the 1st to 50 mults..... bonus for low power.
Just a few off the top of my head. Team play where the team that does X
1st or has the cleanest log gets more points. The options are endless.
This will not be a game for the old guard or a contest for the old
guard. People in general dislike change from the norm, old people are
even
worse. It will take a while and some probably will need to pass on
before
major changes will happen.
W0MU
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 11:08:15 -0400
From: Victor A <va2wdq@gmail.com>
To: Ward Silver <hwardsil@gmail.com>
Cc: CQ-Contest <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID:
<CABnbdfHBUottssx29juh3hE+qv91VHbURdmfs=
pcF8GZVW1Asg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
*Hi Ward,*
Great overview of some existing apps! Since you mentioned the future, let?s
start by looking at what we already have in place.
*1. Node-RED Dashboard Integration / COSB Contest data API.*
As you mentioned, Ward, the Node-RED dashboard is a great tool. At COSB (
https://contestonlinescore.com/), we collaborated with Kyle AA0Z and
Connor
KD9LSV, providing contest data via a special API we developed for the
Node-RED Contest Dashboard. Unfortunately, I haven?t heard any updates from
them since 2023?hopefully, all is well on their end.
The best outcome from that collaboration is that we began offering online
scoring data for third-party use. This is exactly what Gerry, W1VE,
referred to?massive, real-time analysis of incoming contest data, ready to
be put to work. If you?re interested, just contact us.
*2. ?Contest Within a Contest? Concept*
This idea is also ready to go. We?ve had preliminary discussions with some
of the CQWW team about running the Real-Time Contest (RTC) service in
parallel with CQ WW, using different time categories to make participation
more affordable for part-time operators.
Since the RTC service at HAMSCORE (https://hamscore.com/) collects all
participants? logs, this would be a true adjudicated contest?and we?re even
considering real trophies (sponsors welcome!). Naturally, log-check data
would only be revealed after the official CQWW log submission deadline.
You can get involved right now! Our first RTC parallel test will take place
during the CWOps Open this September.
*3. The Future is Here: Real-Time Contesting*
With RTC, full contest results are available within minutes after the event
ends. If you want to see the ?future? of contesting?it?s already here.
Join our weekly RTC mini-contests: CWT, K1USN, ICWC-MST, and Weekly RTTY.
It?s the real taste of real fun! )) You can find more details here:
https://blog.contestonlinescore.com/real-time-contesting-rtc-is-our-new-project/
If you?re interested in new contesting technology and want to help with
testing and development, join our discussion group:
https://groups.io/g/RTC-HAMSCORE
73,
Victor, VA2WA
https://contestonlinescore.com Team
RTC Group / HAMSCORE.com
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 12:51:47 -0500
From: Rene K5JX <k5jx@earthlink.net>
To: CQ-Contest@contesting.com
Subject: [CQ-Contest] Kansas City Keyer
Message-ID: <8dcf8280-bd4e-4672-89b3-0d6c0732a165@earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
I received a .pdf copy of the manual last night. *Many thanks to Ed AJ6V!*
73.
Rene K5JX
On 08/13/2025 11:33 PM GMT Rene K5JX<k5jx@earthlink.net> wrote:
Greetings!
I realize this may be a shot in the dark, but I'll ask anyway. Some
years ago, I "inherited" a Lance Johnson Engineering Kansas City Keyer,
without the paddle pushbuttons or the manual, from my friend Ken K5TSQ
(SK).
I've searched high and low on the web but have had no luck finding a
copy of the manual. Would anyone happen to have a .pdf copy of it you
might be able to email to me?
Thanks very much.
Vy 73.
Rene K5JX
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 17:57:28 +0000 (UTC)
From: RT Clay <rt_clay@bellsouth.net>
To: CQ Contest <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID: <1954856853.5564102.1755194248778@mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Actually, there are not as many "radio" contests left these days compared
to 1993, they ARE going extinct. That is because many no longer have a
non-assisted category. Sure, you can operate using just radio and no
internet, but only at a serious disadvantage.
Tor N4OGW
On Thursday, August 14, 2025 at 12:33:55 PM CDT, Doug Grant <
dougk1dg@gmail.com> wrote:
This discussion about the future reminded me of a piece I wrote back in
1993
<
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/az2n7qtgr1ll21dcg9rxy/Reflections-on-the-2005-CQWWW-Contest.pdf?rlkey=9n02x4b4b8v8235hc2fkjfz0u&st=6fbusa61&dl=0
.
I thought that contests conducted by radio transmission would have gone
extinct by 2005, but here we are in 2025, still dancing with the
ionosphere.
Anyway, while we are thinking about the future, maybe this will be
entertaining.
73,
Doug K1DG
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 14:15:12 -0400
From: <john@kk9a.com>
To: <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID: <000901dc0d47$60f2b470$22d81d50$@kk9a.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Contest activity does not appear to be declining!
https://cqww.com/stats.htm
John KK9A
Doug Grant K1DG wrote:
This discussion about the future reminded me of a piece I wrote back in
1993
<
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/az2n7qtgr1ll21dcg9rxy/Reflections-on-the-200
5-CQWWW-Contest.pdf?rlkey=9n02x4b4b8v8235hc2fkjfz0u&st=6fbusa61&dl=0
<https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/az2n7qtgr1ll21dcg9rxy/Reflections-on-the-2005-CQWWW-Contest.pdf?rlkey=9n02x4b4b8v8235hc2fkjfz0u&st=6fbusa61&dl=0>
.
I thought that contests conducted by radio transmission would have gone
extinct by 2005, but here we are in 2025, still dancing with the
ionosphere.
Anyway, while we are thinking about the future, maybe this will be
entertaining.
73,
Doug K1DG
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 20:36:19 +0100
From: Lee Volante <g0mtn1@gmail.com>
To: cq-contest@contesting.com
Subject: [CQ-Contest] WRTC 2026 reflector
Message-ID:
<CAA-DrXRM+5Pc9ZwTdSQKxgJNsMneS+vH=
6CJRF5_D4RSxxA7qg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Hi,
As we've only 11 months until WRTC 2026 next July in the UK, here's a
reminder for anyone that might be interested in following the news and
progress on how to join the public discussion email reflector.
Please visit https://groups.io/g/wrtc2026-discuss to subscribe to
individual emails, a digest, or instead choose to browse messages online as
you wish.
It's a busy time for the project overall with the qualification programme
just completed, the Team Leader and Team Mate selection about to get
underway, and from there Referee selection and much more.
Thanks to everyone for their support and interest so far which is
much appreciated by the organising team.
73,
Lee G0MTN
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 16:42:22 -0400
From: Stan Zawrotny <k4sbz.stan@gmail.com>
To: Gerry Hull <gerry@remote.radio>
Cc: David Gilbert <ab7echo@gmail.com>, cq-contest@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID:
<CAPPCcb65Un0WgP5wfN-Aa8EQC4gwHzvtQSwJ=
D0ZLMC3styBGg@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
We need to consider the contest and also possible contests within the
contest as different levels of focus. I found the video about what AA0Z has
done with NodeRed very interesting. Ward Silver mentioned it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OwMKKwDk_w
__________
Stan, K4SBZ
On Wed, Aug 13, 2025 at 8:04?PM Gerry Hull <gerry@remote.radio> wrote:
I've had an oar in the pond in all this for quite a period of time.
I was the inventor of the first online live scoreboard, getscores.org.
That was way back in
2006, 19 years ago. See
https://web.archive.org/web/20071111194139/http://www.getscores.org/ for
some nostalgia.
It seems it has caught on quite well, thanks to VA2WA and the guys at
contestonlinescore.com.
For the longest time, it was sheer blasphamy to share your score with
others. For some, it still is.
However, for the majority of us, it has enhanced our hobby tremendously
--
at least for us that enjoy competitive contesting.
Bruce, WA7BNM's 3830scores.com site has become the defacto results
reporting system. Why? Because it is very old news
getting results months (or even in some cases, weeks) after the event.
Anyone who creates a bogus 3830 score is not a valid competitor --
and at the competition levels where the score really matters -- it might
change a few percent from claimed after adjudication.
So -- we talk about live scoring. There has been a team working on a
version of live scoring for some time -- they have had slight
progress, but none in any way I would term significant. Why is this?
It's not that they haven't put in significant effort, that is for sure.
I believe the focus is on the wrong problem: don't try and solve realtime
score adjudication -- enhance real-time reporting with
live updates and eye-candy UI that will bring in new audiences. Score
adjudication is perfect where it's been IMHO -- the people
who do it for the big contests have been doing it for years, do it well,
and don't want big changes. I get that. For smaller contests,
3830 is the norm.
We can overlay lots of stuff on existing contests. We can create
contests
within contests. Who had the best opening band rate to
EU from NA? Who is doing better hour-by-hour in CQWW vs their score last
year. Right now, all the live stuff is simply presented
as tabular data. That is so 20th century. If you look at the many
graphical sites supporting POTA, you'll see a lot of eye candy that
is exciting. Right now, POTA is the hottest thing since sliced bread!
So -- what do we do? I backed away from helping the current live
scoring
project, because I did not buy into it's vision.
Today, all the data generated by a CQWW, for example, is really TRIVIAL
to
the data processing capabilites of the internet and
cloud platforms. However, the problem needs to envisioned with a
solution
that fits a different purpose.
Ward, W0AX presented a vision of this a decade (or what it two) ago.
Nothing really became of it.
Perhaps we partner with some smart Internet contesters who have a flare
for
real time graphics and come up with some
compelling content. This should not ruffle the feathers of the the most
strident radio luddite. The internet has been providing
data about radio (specifically ham radio) since it's inception.
Yep, everyone can shoot holes at this idea. That's what people do.
However, as many have said, we are losing more and more
contesters every day. At some point, there will be many fewer to work.
73,
Gerry W1VE VE1RM ZF2VE 7Q2T
On Mon, Aug 11, 2025 at 1:41?AM David Gilbert <ab7echo@gmail.com> wrote:
A friend of mine (Bob, K7ZB) just sent me a link to a recent video
interview of Tom, W2SC (aka 8P5A) done by W1DED. In addition to
descriptions of his station and approach to contesting, Tom speculates
on where ham radio and contesting in particular might go in the future.
He pointed out that whatever happens will most likely be determined by
a
younger generation that isn't bound by what ham radio is to those of us
who have been at it for a while.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ck-RMIyjSfI
His view of the future is very interesting, and I agree that if ham
radio survives to any significant extent it will have to change ... and
it will likely be changed by a younger generation that comes up with a
way to adapt ham radio to something that is more interesting to them.
Personally, I've always thought that contesting should figure out how
to
become more like an online video game:
1. Integrated computer graphics that display participants on a playing
field ... Earth or maybe even some simulated world. You could zoom in
or zoom out, but the part of the world available to be seen on your
screen could be determined by the real time propagation at that moment.
To make a contact you'd have to zoom in far enough to see the station
you're trying to contact, and the display would show their current
frequency. Real time propagation could be derived from actual contacts
being made if everyone's computer was connected to a common server ...
just like is done with video games. And before anyone says that real
time internet connectivity is an issue, keep in mind that it isn't at
all problem for the demographic we'd be trying to reach.
2. Multiplayer .... where every participant shows up on the screen at
their actual (or simulated) QTH.
3. ACTUAL COMPETITION! Instead of just trying to make the most
contacts and finding out at the end how you did, make each contact some
sort of competition that gets displayed on the screen ... and have some
way of preventing others from making a contact. How that happens would
depend upon the context of the particular game, just like there are
different video games. But the idea would be to contest each contact
in
some manner that requires either an offensive action or a defensive
one.
4. "Contacts" (whatever the game required for a point) would still
purely come via RF ... station to station. The video display and
central server would only provide the environment for making the
contacts, albeit a hopefully more elaborate and richer environment than
whatever we currently picture in our minds while making contacts now.
Some people might say that this is actually no different than a video
game and that video games have the advantage of a level playing field
since most computers don't hinder your play. And that's precisely why
I
think a ham radio version might be more interesting. Propagation,
antennas, choice of times and bands would all make the game more
complex
than the typical online video game. The play style would be enriched by
the variables of ham radio and the technical side of the hobby would be
retained.
The biggest problem I see with something like this is getting the
programming done. Successful video games can take years and lots of
money to develop, although there are games like Valheim that didn't ...
at least not by comparison. However, I strongly suspect that it won't
be too long before AI could do something like this, or at least most of
it. We wouldn't need the complexity of a top tier video game, and
graphics engines are becoming increasingly accessible for simple
environments. Station wise, I don't think it would be any different
than it is now to use a logger for rig control and score tracking ...
just different software.
I realize that the actual game mechanics are missing here. That's
because I'm not smart enough to come up with the specifics. But I am
convinced that something like this could be done ... it's really just a
simple visual interface with an RF connection for the points instead of
data packets. The number of made contacts would be MUCH fewer than it
is now for a typical contest, but each contact could potentially
require
more thought and focus. Think in terms of catching fish instead of
hammering out CQ's.
Thoughts?
Dave
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 13:49:35 -0700
From: Jim Brown <k9yc@audiosystemsgroup.com>
To: cq-contest@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID:
<9910a5e5-406b-4650-9570-9a7f8fddc610@audiosystemsgroup.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
On 8/13/2025 12:47 PM, Gerry Hull wrote:
Who had the best opening band rate to
EU from NA?
The structure of contest rules and scoring that makes this the defining
property of so many contests is what's wrong with contesting! Until this
changes, DRASTICALLY, all of these otherwise very interesting
suggestions are just pissing in the wind.
73, Jim K9YC
------------------------------
Message: 10
Date: Thu, 14 Aug 2025 18:20:43 -0400
From: Tim Shoppa <tshoppa@gmail.com>
To: CQ-Contest Reflector <cq-contest@contesting.com>,
ab7echo@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID:
<
CAJ_qRva2wtTnmA2vZ1xF2UmoJ5dcsoY4M_yiMpQVs1B6FNeXsQ@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
AB7E writes:
Instead of tuning around looking for stations, imagine a visual
interface representing a colorful, fairly detailed, immersive world that
we had to physically explore to find other operators.
IMHO a SDR waterfall already is a colorful detailed immersive world showing
me signals that might be workable. Or even better an empty spot that'll be
my new run freq.
Combine the spectrum with spots, RBN, or other info if going assisted to
get even more labeled visual and colorful interface. Or go it alone and use
your eyes and ears to determine where to tune and listen.
I can look at the past 20 seconds or so and see that some stations are in
CQ loops with no callers and see other stations have crazy huge pileups. So
I can see not just the guy I want to work but if I'll see my competition
too.
Given the turnaround time of modern contesting (just a few seconds) it's
already very engaging and interactive to contest this way.
I think modern RTTY contesting (with several weapons-grade decoders with
advanced tuning and waterfall displays of their own) is similarly engaging.
Tim N3QE
------------------------------
Message: 11
Date: Fri, 15 Aug 2025 10:22:25 +0200
From: Steve IK4WMH <ik4wmh@virgilio.it>
To: cq-contest@contesting.com
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Ham Radio in the Future
Message-ID: <1410501505.20250815102225@virgilio.it>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
I've read about gaming, computer graphics, dashboards, immersive
worlds, real time contests and other fancy things.
They appear to me far too FT8ish.
I hope no contest committee will make them compulsory.
Just my 3 cents (used to be 2 cents, blame the tariffs).
73 es gl
Steve IK4WMH
--
Questa email ? stata esaminata alla ricerca di virus dal software
antivirus Avast.
www.avast.com
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
------------------------------
End of CQ-Contest Digest, Vol 272, Issue 14
*******************************************
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
_______________________________________________
CQ-Contest mailing list
CQ-Contest@contesting.com
http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest
|