Topband
[Top] [All Lists]

Topband: Ladder line vs coax loss epiphany

To: Kenneth Silverman <kenny.k2kw@gmail.com>, "topband@contesting.com" <topband@contesting.com>
Subject: Topband: Ladder line vs coax loss epiphany
From: "Shoppa, Tim" <tshoppa@wmata.com>
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2014 15:32:07 +0000
List-post: <topband@contesting.com">mailto:topband@contesting.com>
It took me literally decades to realize this, but the low ladder line losses 
that show up in the ARRL graphs are not because ladder line is magical. I had 
been reading many articles in QST, and on the web, that made it seem like 
ladder line was magical this way. Really, for decades I did not understand why 
ladder line had so much less loss than comparable-copper coax.

It's because ladder line is used at 450 or 600 ohm impedance, so it of course 
has one tenth the resistive losses of 50 ohm coax built with similar amount of 
copper.

There a similar (but smaller) advantage to 75 ohm coax vs 52 ohm coax.

Tim N3QE

-----Original Message-----
From: Topband [mailto:topband-bounces@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Kenneth 
Silverman
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2014 11:00 AM
To: topband@contesting.com
Subject: Re: Topband: 1000 feet 5/8" hardline or 600ohm True Ladder lin

Rune,

Back in 1997 N6BV and I did some testing using "ladder line" (not the real
600 ohm stuff) and some 9:1 baluns on each end.  We were looking at a site in 
YV where the beach was about 1000' from the hotel room. We tested the
following:
- loss in back to back baluns
- loss in 100' of ladder line and baluns on each end

We tested 160 to 10m.  We lost the data but I seem to remember the total loss 
on 80/160 with 1000' of line was negligible.  Maybe in the 2 dB range on 10m 
with 1000' of ladder line.

A few of us went to the YV location to run the IARU contest with the 1000'
run of ladder line, using a single vertical on the beach.  The system worked 
well, except when there was rain (varying SWR), or coconuts and palm fronds 
fell and broke the line.

I just talked to N6BV and he said the ARRL Labratory recently did some careful 
measurements on matched-line losses for open-wire line for input to Dean's TLW 
program.  There is a new executable that contains the algorithms for loss 
computation.

Good luck, Kenny K2KW
_________________
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband
_________________
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband

<Prev in Thread] Current Thread [Next in Thread>