Topband
[Top] [All Lists]

Re: Topband: Short receiving verticals question

To: Tom W8JI <w8ji@w8ji.com>, topband <topband@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: Topband: Short receiving verticals question
From: Jon Zaimes AA1K <jz73@verizon.net>
Date: Sat, 01 Feb 2014 12:07:02 -0500
List-post: <topband@contesting.com">mailto:topband@contesting.com>
Thanks Tom and others for detailed comments on this issue.

I understand the focus on bandwidth, presumably to keep the phasing constant across 100 kHz or less of 160 meters, and see how that would be important with fixed phasing. But in my bs/ef, the two forward elements are fed in phase (equal-length feed lines to a T) and so are the two rearward ones. The two feedlines from these Ts then run to the shack where a DX Engineering NCC-1 (W8JI design) is used to adjust the phasing between the two sets of elements. I'm thinking the variable phasing should compensate for any changes in phasing across the band due to narrow bandwidth of the elements, or any changes from variation due to proximity to trees or in tree foliage change through the seasons. At worst I would need to re-adjust the phasing control as I QSY up and down the band. But maybe there's another issue I'm missing.

My first RX bs/ef has only been functioning a few weeks, including the CW 160m contest, and is still a work in progress. For now the 23-foot elements are fed directly with the feedline center conductor (no series coil and resistor yet) so are resonant around 80 meters. They do have the top hat wires though they are tied off rather haphazardly to convenient trees. And the equal-length feedlines from the elements to the Ts are simply laid on the ground, with no choking toroids at the feedpoint nor a ground rod for the shield out 15 feet from the feedpoint as I use on Beverage feedlines. About 100 feet of the two hardline runs going to the NCC-1 are buried closest to the house. There is a ground rod at the T junction. Elements have twenty 25-foot radials and are tied to a 2-3 ft. ground rod and the coax shield at each feedpoint. I'm using 75 ohm Pentabond CATV cable for the four equql feedlines (184 feet each) and 3/4 inch CATV 75 ohm hardline from the Ts to the shack. Because the elements are not yet matched/tuned for 160, their output is lower than the Beverages.

Even at this "development" stage, I have found this array to be almost always better for hearing Europe than any of the three phased Beverage pairs I have (535 ft and 750 ft stagger phased and 950 ft with 200 ft broadside spacing). It is really cool to flip the switch to reverse the phasing and see the difference in f/b, and also to tune through the phasing range and find other peaks available from the continuous 0-360 degree adjustment, and to optimize the f/b to null out signals and noise off the rear. I also found this array had some useful f/b on 80 meters despite the very wide broadside spacing (but the endfire spacing is 1/4 wave on 80). The f/b on 160 meters on the short verticals is significantly better than from any of the Beverages in nulling out a persistent, intermittent local noise from the southwest that I've been unable to track down.

I like W3LPL's suggestion to use the 7-foot posts to keep the wires above deer level. And also a tip from WW4B to use lightweight fishing line to tie off the ends, making this the weak link in the system, so any falling tree branches will snap this line rather than the element itself or the wire. Replacing the fishing line will be a lot easier than repairing an element or wire in terms of ongoing, long-term maintenance. I'll adopt both of these ideas here.

73/Jon AA1K


On 1/30/2014 5:24 AM, Tom W8JI wrote:

But what about an element loaded with a coil at the center or at the top? Would there be advantages to that approach that would come close to the short verticals with top-hat wires, or any serious disadvantages?


Jon,

The reason I use the hats and do everything I do in the elements is bandwidth. Even at my quiet rural location on the quietest hour of the quietest day, almost any element of reasonable height will have more than enough signal level. This is why I base load and use a large hat. While the large hat tends to keep current more uniform throughout the element independent of coil location, and while more uniform current increases radiation resistance, that effect is meaningless to me. The entire goal for me is bandwidth, or a stable SWR vs. frequency.

Bandwidth is also why I load the element with a series resistance for matching, instead of a network. I want to "swamp out" or dilute the effects of resonance, minimizing element phase shift vs. frequency change at the element terminals and preventing drastic changes in element feedpoint impedance from mutual coupling between elements.

The hat is actually the bulk of the loading, and sets the current distribution. The coil just cancels reactance. Since it is a series network with the inductor forming a series tank with the termination reactance, the lower the reactance used (compared to termination resistance) the larger bandwidth becomes. You want the loading coil to be terminated in the lowest capacitive reactance possible, and that is at the antenna base.

Because voltage and current are out-of-phase above the coil, even with high current, the impedance increases. This means the tradeoff in a bottom inductance is increased voltage above the inductor. The antenna is more "loss critical" above the coil for anything coupled via the electric field, including a lossy dielectric.

This is a compromise of two things:

1.) Bandwidth

2.) Sensitivity to dielectrics around the element

Getting rid of the hat while the element is close to a tree does nothing but bad things to both, but no one can say how much. The last resort for me would be no "hats". Perhaps you can use T elements with loading wires away from foliage that might change tuning or losses?

73 Tom
_________________
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband


_________________
Topband Reflector Archives - http://www.contesting.com/_topband

<Prev in Thread] Current Thread [Next in Thread>