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Re: [RFI] DSC Alarm Panel 75 Meters/False Alarms

To: "rfi@contesting.com" <rfi@contesting.com>
Subject: Re: [RFI] DSC Alarm Panel 75 Meters/False Alarms
From: "Jim Brown" <jim@audiosystemsgroup.com>
Reply-to: Jim Brown <jim@audiosystemsgroup.com>
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2004 07:16:26 -0600
List-post: <mailto:rfi@contesting.com>
On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 07:33:04 -0500, Brad Roope wrote:

>installed a common split core around the leads at the input to the panel.  

Common split cores are optimized for 50 MHz and us, and would not be expected 
to 
be effective at 4 MHz. 

>In addition he grounded the new panel to the common telephone/electrical 
>ground.
>
>If DSC does not respond to their RFI Issue, I may ask my neighbor if I can 
>install 
>#77 beads at the input to the Alarm Panel. I may get only one opportunity so I 
>need 
>to know if multiple beads on each lead would be better that just one?

Your tone sounds defensive -- it should not be. DSC is the guy with the 
problem, and 
THEY should be working much harder to resolve this.  My guess is that there is 
a "pin 1 
problem" in their equipment, excited by common mode current on the interconnect 
wiring (receiving antenna). Choking that common mode current could fix it. 

Some basic principles of beads. The series impedance is proportional to the 
length of 
the bead along the wire. So yes, more is better, but the series impedance is 
not likely 
to be large enough to make a dent, even with multiple beads.  

The series resistance is also proportional to the square of the number of 
turns, and it is 
far more likely that a multi-turn choke of #78, #31, or #43 material would 
solve your 
problem.  

Fair-Rite makes 2.4" toroids of #78 and #43 material.  I would start with 8 
turns around 
either of those. Fair-Rite also makes some big clamp-ons of #31 that can be 
used to 
form multi-turn chokes around wiring that either can't easily be disconnected 
or has a 
connector on it too large to fit through a solid core or toroid. 

>I may also install by-pass capacitors on each lead. 

Bypass capacitors are probably inappropriate if there is data on the line (as 
opposed 
to a dc signal generated by the sensor). And it is far more likely to be common 
mode. 

Another point. Look at the interconnect cable. Is it twisted pair?  It should 
be. Is it tightly 
twisted? It should be. Twisted pairs have solved LOTS of RFI problems when RF 
was 
getting into the output terminals of power amplifiers via zip cord used as 
speaker wire. 
My first choice would be a decent CAT5 cable, and it should NOT be shielded. 
Most 
cable shields can CAUSE common mode current to be coupled onto the signal pair 
as 
a differential mode signal. 

I wouldn't rule out coupling through the power supply wiring, but I would 
attack the signal 
wiring first. 

All of this, of course, is the responsibility of the installation company and 
the equipment 
manufacturer. Don't let them make THEIR problem YOUR problem. Let them know 
that 
this is all well established science, and that you are willing to cooperate by 
firing up 
your transmitter for testing on a schedule that is reasonably convenient to you 
(but not 
when you must take time off work). But make it clear that you know that fixing 
it is 
THEIR responsibility, not yours. 

BTW -- you are welcome to print this email and show it to your neighbor. And 
you can 
tell them that I am vice-chair of the Standards Committee of the Audio 
Engineering 
Society's Working Group on EMC, and that I'm a consulting designing sound 
systems 
for both large and small installations. 


Jim Brown
Audio Systems Group, Inc.
Chicago
http://audiosystemsgroup.com


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