EdThere isn't a category for SB assisted so he would need to submit his score
as SOAB Assisted. So I guess all those guys who post their scores on 3830 as
single band assisted have them reclassified as SOAB Assisted. N2IC pointed out
to me a rule that I missed in the General ARRL Rules that say you can't use non
radio assistance to solicit contacts. I guess it's up to the people at the ARRL
contest desk to determine if running a live stream constitutes soliciting
contacts like calling someone on the phone or using Facebook to arrange QSO'S.
JeffSent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Edward Sawyer
<EdwardS@sbelectronics.com> Date: 3/12/20 3:18 PM (GMT-05:00) To: Jeff Clarke
<ku8e@ku8e.com>, cq-contest@contesting.com Subject: RE: [CQ-Contest] Merging
Social Media and Contesting Jeff. I agree with you that the ARRL rules leave a
lot of gap. And if Ray enters as 20M SB Assisted, he probably has an argument.
However if he enters unassisted, he is in clear violation of "using the
internet" which is not allowed for any active part of the QSO or finding
process. CQ WW and CQ WPX additionally have Conduct rules defining soliciting
contacts through non-amateur means. I don't think even the assisted class
would allow what Ray was doing.But the Contest sponsors should speak up on this
issue.Ed N1UR________________________________________From: CQ-Contest
[cq-contest-bounces+edwards=sbelectronics.com@contesting.com] On Behalf Of Jeff
Clarke [ku8e@ku8e.com]Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2020 1:36 PMTo:
cq-contest@contesting.comSubject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Merging Social Media and
ContestingI think in the future contest sponsors need to define exactly
whatassisted means in their contest since the way the rules are
sometimeswritten they can be ambiguous.For Example :*CQWW Rules for SO but
allowed for SOA :*/*QSO finding assistance*//: The use of any technology or
other sourcethat provides call sign or multiplier identification of a signal to
theoperator. This includes, but is not limited to, use of a CW decoder,
DXcluster, DX spotting web sites (e.g., DX Summit), local or remote callsign
and frequency decoding technology (e.g., CW Skimmer or ReverseBeacon Network),
or operating arrangements involving other individuals.//Self-spotting or asking
to be spotted is not permitted. (not allowedfor SOA either)/*ARRL Rules :*/3.2.
Single Operator Unlimited://////The use of spotting assistance or automated,
multi-channel decoders ispermitted.//////2.2.1. Use of spotting assistance or
nets (operating arrangementsinvolving other individuals, DX-alerting nets,
packet, multi-channeldecoders such as CW Skimmer, etc) not physically located
at the stationis permitted. (Exception: spotting information obtained from any
sourceoutside the station boundary via a closed or dedicated communicationlink
may not be used.)////////3.3.3. Single Band entries are NOT permitted to use
spottingassistance. Use of spotting assistance will cause the entry to
bereclassified to the Single Operator Unlimited, High Power category./I think
the CQWW rules are much clearer than the ARRL's. In fact theARRL DX rules
makes no mention of self-spotting. Also note neithermention live streaming. I'm
sure Ray, W2RE is a good guy and he wasn'tintending on cheating or gaining some
type of competitive advantage.He's been contesting a long time and given much
back to the contestingcommunity with his tower company and RHR. I think most
active contestersknow who the habitual cheaters are and he isn't one of
them.W2RE posted his score as SB 20 meters. If he submits his entry as
SOassisted based on the rules I quoted above he should have no problemsbecause
he didn't break any rules for an ARRL sponsored contest. Contestsponsors also
need to determine if running a live stream is consideredto be self-spotting and
update their rules for next time. (CQWW Rules)I wish you guys wouldn't pile on
and accuse W2RE of cheating because hedidn't. Read the ARRL DX rules.
http://www.arrl.org/arrl-dxJeff KU8EOn 3/12/2020 11:30 AM,
donovanf@starpower.net wrote:> I'm surprised at Randy's comment that " it is
impossible to measure the impact or harm">>> Unique QSOs in the W2RE log will
provide a measure of the impact>>> 73> Frank> W3LPL>>> ----- Original Message
----->> From: k5zd@charter.net> To: "Edward Sawyer"
<EdwardS@sbelectronics.com>, cq-contest@contesting.com> Sent: Thursday, March
12, 2020 3:12:10 PM> Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Merging Social Media and
Contesting>> I am in favor of big stations and remote operations. Live
streaming so> others can hear what it sounds like is also good. Promoting ham
radio and> contesting using social media is great (and needed)!>> I share the
concerns about when the live PR effort bleeds into soliciting> activity for the
station doing this. The rules are fairly clear that use> of non-amateur means
to solicit contacts is prohibited (written back when> people would use the
telephone to get multipliers on the air).>> In this case, it is impossible to
measure the impact or harm. I.e., we> don't know how much it helped the score
or if it would have changed the> order of finish. Even so, the rules are the
rules. It will be up to the> sponsor to decide where they want to draw the line
for their contest.>> Randy K5ZD>>> -----Original Message-----> From: CQ-Contest
<cq-contest-bounces+k5zd=charter.net@contesting.com> On> Behalf Of Edward
Sawyer> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 8:56 PM> To: peter.voelpel@t-online.de;
cq-contest@contesting.com> Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Merging Social Media and
Contesting>> IF you watch the video, you will see broadcasting of frequency on
the> sidebar chats being displayed - self spotting. Using a chat room. And by>
asking people on line to share the feed with their friends and get on and> work
him - he is soliciting contacts by non-amateur means.>> Ed N1UR>>> From: Peter
Voelpel [peter.voelpel@t-online.de] On Behalf Of> dj7ww@t-online.de
[dj7ww@t-online.de]> Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 8:24 PM> To: Edward
Sawyer; cq-contest@contesting.com> Subject: RE: [CQ-Contest] Merging Social
Media and Contesting>> Ed,>> what numerous rules violations do you have in
mind?> So far I am not aware of any.>> 73> Peter>> -----Original Message----->
From: CQ-Contest> [mailto:cq-contest-bounces+dj7ww=t-online.de@contesting.com]
On Behalf Of> Edward Sawyer>> I would suggest that anyone curious take a listen
to the live stream> recording on YouTube and look at the interaction Ray has
with the "live chat> room" on his website with the contacts being made.>>
Asking people to look for him on the Cluster to see where he is.>> Even as an
assisted operation, it demonstrates numerous rules violations as> recorded.>>
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