Today's networks carry nothing but data. Voice, including from traditional
carriers, is being carried as data over the same pipes that carry the internet
traffic. The difference is in the guaranteed Quality of Service, which we
recognize as predictably high quality voice calls.
Let's assume for a moment that you do have to pay for long distance from your
traditional carrier. Even at 5 cents per minute, the total charge for the
typical 48 hour contest is $145. IMHO, this is not so bad. In fact, if you were
to convert this into mileage on your car, this only equivalent to about 260
miles round trip. In other words, if your remote QTH is more than 260 miles
round trip, you may be better off paying that 5 cents per minute :-)
I get 12 Mbps down and about 7 Mbps up in rural VE3 over a 4G network. Latency
and jitter however are terrible, to the point where VPN times out and VoIP
calls are impossible.
Rudy N2WQ
________________________________
From: Gerry Hull <gerry@yccc.org>
To: Rudy Bakalov <r_bakalov@yahoo.com>
Cc: CQ-Contest <cq-contest@contesting.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Remote contest operation
IMHO, POTS costs from traditional carriers are still not that inexpensive.
If you use VoIP (low cost), you might as well just use the internet.
Internet remote is viable for anyone that can get broadband service at as
sustained 1Mbps up/down, for a very good user experience.
For cross-town remote, this is easy. Going across the country or between
countries is harder, but we have seen lots of evidence on this reflector
that people are doing it.
73. Gerry W1VE
On Thu, Apr 11, 2013 at 1:53 PM, Rudy Bakalov <r_bakalov@yahoo.com> wrote:
I wonder if good old POTS and modems are unjustly ignored as a viable option
for carrying the control channel and audio; computer screen sharing can still
go over the net. POTS have the benefit of predictable performance and possibly
lower latency. The control channel to/from the remote station (perhaps under 20
kbps) + the audio (around 4 kbps) can easily fit in what a modem point to point
network can offer.
>
>Long distance charges are no longer an issue either with many households
>having unlimited domestic/Canada calling plans.
>
>Thoughts?
>
>
>
>Rudy N2WQ
>
>
>________________________________
> From: Gerry Hull <gerry@yccc.org>
>To: Jim Jordan <k4qpl@nc.rr.com>
>Cc: Barry <w2up@comcast.net>; cq-contest@contesting.com
>Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2013 12:13 PM
>
>Subject: Re: [CQ-Contest] Remote contest operation
>
>
>GoToMyPC is great, but not required.
>
>If you use a free VPN, you get all those features, with less latency.
>
>Once you have a connection, you can use any program you want -- all the
>ones you've listed will work just fine.
>
>In a PM with Barry, he explained to me that he saw a lot of jitter on the
>connection... sometimes >100mS. This is going to play havoc with realtime
>audio over UDP, and, depending on
how sent CW is being generated, can
>really be a mess.
>
>I've seen Remoterig run flawlessly over a Verizon 4G LTE connection. Most
>modern internet providers can provide plenty of bandwidth. The problems
>are related to having a continuous stream with low latency and very little
>jitter. Latency is a pain, because you will be delays, but jitter (large
>changes in latency over a short period of time) will cause all kinds of
>problems.
>
>Some think that it's Comcast shaping traffic. I don't think so. In
>Barry's case, one end of the circuit is a point-to-point microwave hop.
>Well, my ISP at home is point-to-point microwave (I have two connections,
>one on 900 MHz and another at 2.4 GHz). I have seen lots of jitter and
>latency issues on my connections when the network was not properly
>configured or overloaded. It took a bunch of work to get my provider to
>fix
things. I use VoIP for telephony, and had a bunch of issues with that.
> Besides, I use lots of non-Comcast VoIP over our Comcast connection at
>work (New England) and it works flawlessly.
>
>If you think you are having traffic shaping issues, I have a public
>NeoRouter VPN server that I'm happy to let any hams use. Send me an email
>and I'll give you a login. You can download a free client from
>www.neorouter.com. Once you do that, you'll get a private IP address in
>the 192.168.25.x address range; you can even use DNS to connect to systems
>on the other end, using the computer's name..
>
>73, Gerry W1VE
>
>On Wed, Apr 10, 2013 at 9:26 PM, Jim Jordan <k4qpl@nc.rr.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Barry,
>>
>> I also operate remote with a TS480. However, I opted not to use Remoterig
>> for concern about the very
issues you are experiencing. I leave my entire
>> radio at home and use what I consider (no I'm not paid!) to be the most
>> bullet proof remote desktop, www.GoToMyPC.com which I also use in my
>> business for its reliability. Not free, but worth it IMHO. By using remote
>> desktop I can control other things including N1MM Logger, HamSwitch (for
>> antenna switching and other peripherals). I'm not using Winkey so I can't
>> use a paddle right now and not even sure if I want it. I use keyboard
>> sending with the free software CWType loaded on the shack computer or
>> keyboard sending with N1MM. Not a big deal for most contests since I use
>> N1MM on my shack computer which is doing 98% of the work and all keying is
>> local. That eliminates almost any possibility of defective keying
>> originating with the contest program as the only thing that is carried by
>> the remote desktop
program are your keystrokes including a specific "F" key
>> or "Enter" if you use ESM. To carry the audio I use Skype with the
>> microphone muted at the remote end and the Skype AGC turned off at both
>> ends. That pretty much eliminates latency. Ocassionally there will be a bad
>> Skype connection. Hang up and call again. I did the CQ 160 remote and also
>> Sprint RTTY. Check into some cw nets and a few casual QSO's when I'm
>> travelling.
>>
>> There will always be a few occasions where you experience temporary drop
>> out no matter what system you have but it shouldn't seriously affect your
>> operations. That's the price of remote in a less than perfect cyberworld. I
>> did upgrade my Time Warner connection to 10Mb/S. Checking it on Speedtest
>> shows it delivers as promised. You can also reduce the risk by using a
>> 100Mb CAT5 connection to your router if available instead of
wireless from
>> your laptop. Oh, yes, if your internet connection is less than perfect, be
>> sure your XYL isn't streaming a movie from NetFlix!!
>>
>> With this setup I need absolutely nothing on the road but my laptop and
>> some cheap headphones to keep from bothering other people. I'm leaving on
>> an overseas trip tomorrow, again taking nothing but my laptop, and I'll see
>> what happens.
>>
>> Good luck and 73,
>>
>> Jim, K4QPL
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barry" <w2up@comcast.net>
>> To: <cq-contest@contesting.com>
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2013 7:42 PM
>> Subject: [CQ-Contest] Remote contest operation
>>
>>
>>
>> I tried some remote operation in the 10m
contest using a TS480 and
>>> Remoterig. The radio control worked fine, but we had lots of problems with
>>> dropped dits, timing problems, etc. on CW, presumably due to dropped
>>> packets and/or latency issues. I don't know if it's my particular network
>>> or a common problem, but I've heard others using Comcast as an ISP having
>>> similar issues.
>>>
>>> I wonder if anyone has had success using some other remote system for CW
>>> contesting.
>>>
>>> Tnx,
>>> Barry W2UP
>>>
>>> ______________________________**_________________
>>> CQ-Contest mailing list
>>> CQ-Contest@contesting.com
>>> http://lists.contesting.com/**mailman/listinfo/cq-contest<http://lists.contesting.com/mailman/listinfo/cq-contest>
>>>
>>
>> ______________________________**_________________
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>
>>
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